Grammar Info

N3 Lesson 5: 20/22

さえEven

Structure

Noun + (で) + さえ
Noun + Particle + さえ
Verb + こと(1) + さえ + (する)
Verb［stem］+ さえ + (する)
Verb［て］+ さえ +(いる)

(1) の

Details

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About さえ

さえ is an adverbial particle in Japanese that is used to place emphasis on something existing in certain state. It is often translated as 'even'. さえ has three primary meanings, which are as follows:

Analogical Reasoning: 類推(るいすい) - Analogy, (A) is an outstanding example of something.

Limit: 限定(げんてい) - Limit, (A) is all that is needed for something.

Addition: 添加(てんか) - (A) compounds something that is pre-existing.

さえ is regularly paired with other particles and is often followed by verbs in negative form, with the overall meaning usually being determined by what part (B) of the sentence is conveying. Let's look at a few examples.

In each of these cases, we can see how さえ is showing that (A) is an extreme example of something.

Fun Fact

は, も, でも, and さえ are all adverbial particles that can be thought of as having a relationship toward, and away from what is 'expected' in any given situation. This relationship can be seen here:

(A) は - (A) is completely expected, there is nothing unusual.

(A) も - (A) will be included as part of what is expected, but can be unusual.

(A) でも - (A) may or may not be included as part of what is expected, and can be unusual.

(A) さえ - (A) is separated completely from what is expected, and is unusual.

Due to this unexpected and unusual situation that さえ always presents, it is regularly translated as 'let alone (A)', or 'not to mention (A)'.

Related

Examples

--:--

    富士山(ふじさん)の頂上(ちょうじょう)は夏(なつ)でさえ寒(さむ)い。

    It is cold on the summit of Mt. Fuji even in summer.

    そんな初歩的(しょほてき)なことは、子供(こども)でさえ知(し)っている。

    Even children know things that basic.

    小(ちい)さい戦(たたか)いさえ、私(わたし)はしたことがない。

    I've never even been in a small fight.

    あのことについてさえ知(し)っているんです。

    I even know about that thing.

    家族(かぞく)さえも応援(おうえん)してくれないんです。

    Even my family doesn't support me.

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さえ – Grammar Discussion

Most Recent Replies (6 in total)

  • mrnoone

    mrnoone

    English translation:
    even

    Structure:
    Noun + particle + でさえ/さえ
    Verb + の/こと + さえ + (する)
    Verb[stem] + さえ + (する)
    Verb[て] + さえ + (いる)

    Explanation:
    [さえ is used to emphasize something very surprising, unsual. More than も and でも。Often used to express minimum expectation or in “not only but also” and "let alone"constructions.

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  • seanblue

    seanblue

    Two questions:

    1. Why is について in orange?
    2. Would this sentence be grammatically correct if I used も and would it mean anything close to the sentence with さえ?

  • mrnoone

    mrnoone

    １．It is in orange because it is (compound) particle.
    2. Yes, it would be correct. “I also/even know about that thing.”
    I have added it as alternative answe

    By the way, まで can also be used there.

  • NickavGnaro

    NickavGnaro

    Any advice on what to do to distinguish the usage of さえ and まで（も）? I’ve been struggling to understand when the two are not interchangeable? Specifically, every time that まで(も) could be used, I think, “gee, why can’t I use さえ here?”

  • Daru

    Daru

    さえ puts greater emphasis. Think of it like how かもしれない and はずだ both express certainty, but to different degrees. Hope this helps!

  • ollieisamuppet

    ollieisamuppet

    Maybe im being stupid here, but I dont understand how im supposed to figure out when で is needed and when it isnt needed after a noun. For example, 子供でさえ vs 価値さえ? I dont get why they are treated differently when theyre both nouns. Is it to do with the first being a living thing?

    Thanks

  • NickavGnaro

    NickavGnaro

    If you’re going to use さえ, then you have to use でさえ if it would have been appropriate to use でも. Basically, add the で if the phrase requires a copula.

    子供でさえ = 子供でも = even if (he/she/it) is a child
    (notice the copular “to be” statement creeping in there - that’s what the で is responsible for in this case).

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