Grammar Info

N4 Lesson 2: 3/17

までEven, To even, To the extent of

Structure

Noun + まで(も)

Details

  • Standard

  • Rare Kanji

    迄

About まで

The adverbial particle まで is used in the same way as many other adverbial particles, in that it is highlighting that the statement that comes after it as important in some way. However, unlike our first look at まで, which discussed its use as 'until', this use of まで has the nuance of 'even', or 'to the extent'.

Although using まで as 'even' may seem different to 'until', they are essentially the same thing in Japanese. This is because まで always means '(A) まで, (B)', where (A) is the 'limitation/extent', and (B) is the 'noteworthy factor'. This 'noteworthy factor' will usually be a descriptive word/phrase, such as a verb, adjective, or explanation.

Fun Fact

The も particle is sometimes grouped together with まで, when the meaning is 'even'. This just adds emphasis to the fact that the event is somewhat surprising, or that the result is satisfying.

Related

Examples

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  • こっちまでイライラしてきた。

    Even I am starting to get annoyed. (to the extent・until)

  • それまでやらなくてはいけないの？

    I have to even do that? (to the extent・until)

  • 頭(あたま)まで痛(いた)くなってきた。

    Even my head is starting to hurt. (to the extent・until)

  • 夜中(よなか)まで日本語(にほんご)の文法(ぶんぽう)を勉強(べんきょう)している。

    I'm studying Japanese grammar until the middle of the night. (to the extent・until)

  • お腹(なか)が空(す)いているとき、熊(くま)は果実(かじつ)まで食(た)べる。

    Bears will even go as far as to eat berries when they are hungry. (to the extent・until)

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まで – Grammar Discussion

Most Recent Replies (15 in total)

  • Konachan

    Konachan

    Like @jelly1, I also got confused by the 〜て form used in the examples.

    I got confused by the example: “お金を払ってまでテストを受けたくない” Which uses 払う in its て-form so I searched a the www a bit and came to the conclusion: Using the dictionary form in the above example (お金を払うまでテストを受けたくない) would be translated to “I don’t want to take the test until I payed for it” which fits “Verb + まで” (N5 Lesson 8 6/13) but not までも. As this is new grammar for me, feel free to correct me if I’m wrong but I think it should be “Verb[て] まで”

    • How to use まで ( = made) – Maggie Sensei (A reference included here on bunpro) also states “5. even […] (3) Vて ( verb te-form) + まで ( = made): to do something even doing something/ to go so far as ~”
  • glideus

    glideus

    I’ve also submitted the same report, but never heard back. I also think they meant to put て instead of る.

  • everworld2662

    everworld2662

    Possibly a silly question, but one of the examples in the explanation is

    隣街の店舗まで行ったけど、そこでもお目当てのグッズは売っていなかった。
    I even went to the store in the next town, but even there, the merchandise I was looking for wasn’t being sold.

    I was surprised to see まで being translated in the English as “even” rather than “as far as” or “to the extent of”. Given the placement of まで, attaching it to 隣街の店舗 rather than a nominalised for of “went”, doesn’t it modify/limit the store, rather than the act of going. Ergo, wouldn’t a more accurate translation be

    I went to even the store in the next town, but even there, the merchandise I was looking for wasn’t being sold.

    or, more fluently,

    I went as far as the store in the next town, but even there, the merchandise I was looking for wasn’t being sold.

    Did this trip anybod...

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