上(うえ)でAfter, Upon

Most Recent Replies (23 in total)

• 

  mrnoone

  after, upon

  Structure
  Verb[ た ] + 上で
  Noun + の上で/上で

  View on Bunpro

• 

  airblaster

  The Meaning card is missing the information that this is more formal than atode, which is only presented by an example.

• 

  mrnoone

  Added information about formality

• 

  MysticChameleon

  I’m a little confused on this grammar point, I came here through the tobira path (chapter 11), and yet this grammar point seems to have a different meaning to what’s presented in Tobira.
  Bunpro has it meaning something like ‘upon; after’ but Tobira has the meaning as something like ‘In terms of; from the viewpoint of ~’

• 

  nekoyama

  上で (うえで) is upon/after

  上 (じょう) as a suffix is from the standpoint of…

  bunpro has that one too

• 

  MysticChameleon

  In that case I think the tobira path has mixed up those points, as the one covered in chapter 11 is 上 (じょう), yet bunpro links to 上で (うえで)
  Edit:
  though the strange thing is, in chapter 11 of tobira, it has both ‘Noun+上 (じょう)’, and ‘Nounの上で (うえで)’ listed as the same grammar point, though both are given the same english tranlsation of ‘in terms of’, ‘from the standpoint of’

• 

  nekoyama

  This grammar point is about preparatory actions. So this does sound like a mixup unless Tobira also has the other usage in the same chapter. Note that most of the examples aren’t even with nouns.

  I thought it might have been a context thing because in A Dictionary of Intermediate Japanese Grammar, there is a note that the noun in Nの上で with the preparatory action meaning is usually a noun that describes investigation, discussion, etc. Like the few noun examples in this grammar point, basically.

  However, the “from the standpoint” meaning is listed separately as Nの上では and they specifically make a point that it’s not the same as Nの上で…

• 

  monoverse

  What is the difference between 上で and あとで?

• 

  matt_in_mito

  I would say あとで is used un everyday language but you will only see 上で in more formal situations. I wouldn’t say あとで would necessarily be wrong to use in a more formal situation though, so if in doubt, I would personally use あとで.

• 

  Ambo100

  Looks like the Nihongoの森 link is broken but sadly I can’t find a re-upload.

• 

  Pushindawood

  @Ambo100 Thank you for letting me know! I have uploaded a new video. Cheers!

• 

  RhinoINK

  I agree, I think this is a mixup in the Tobira path, and Chapter 11 should use 上 (from the standpoint of) instead.

  Edit: sorry matt_in_mito, I replied to the wrong post ^^’ I meant [MysticChameleon]'s (上で うえで - Grammar Discussion - #4 by MysticChameleon)

• 

  jmadsen

  thanks, I came here to make this point

  I think the grammar should add a note “this is for things not yet done”, rather than simply saying the order things happen in

• 

  testing

  In 家の中を見た上で、買おうと思っている。(“I am thinking that I will buy the house after I have seen the inside.”), is it clear whether or not the speaker has already seen the house?

• 

  Daru

  It’s clear that they haven’t seen it, because 上で is used to express that something will happen after the fact.

• 

  Brand_S

  What I see more often in the wild is 上で in the context of “according to …,” like this example sentence from A Handbook of Japanese Grammar Patterns:

  暦の上ではもう春だというのに、まだまだ寒い日が続いている。
  “It is still cold, even though it is already spring according to the calendar.”

  I was going to add that as a self-study sentence but I thought I should ask first: should the “according to …” meaning be the same grammar point? Should that be a different grammar point (I searched and didn’t see that Bunpro had it (yet))?

• 

  Fuga

  暦の上では is a special expression used only when talking about how the current weather is unusual for the current season, like the example you have provided. This use of 上 in this expression is closer to this grammar point.

  Hope that clears it up!

• 

  Brand_S

  Thank you! I seriously just saw that that very grammar point was in my next lesson literally seconds ago and I was like, “D’oh!”

• 

  mblasco23

  Hope it’s okay to revive an old thread. Doing some reading on NHK news and came across this sentence.

  氷見市立博物館の廣瀬直樹学芸員は「古い家屋や蔵が解体される際に歴史を知るうえで重要な資料が失われる可能性があります。」

  The 知る上で is throwing me off a little bit. My brain wants to translate his quote simply and just say, “When old houses and storehouses are demolished, important historical materials may be lost.” So where is does the ue de fit in then? Would a literal translation be closer to something like, “When old houses and storehouse are demolished, upon knowing history, historical materials may be lost,” as in “since I know history, I also know that this is a logical progression?”

• 

  nekoyama

  This grammar point is about past+上で which is different from dictionary form+上で. It looks like the video linked in the resources section covers it in the second half.

  I’d read 歴史を知るうえで重要な資料 as “important materials for learning about history”.